Ratna OmidvarProvided for The Globe and Mail/The Globe and Mail
Does Canada harness the talent of the thousands of people immigrating to the country each year?
Current trends indicate employers are increasingly reaching out directly to new Canadians, as well as connecting with them through community organizations such as the Toronto Region Immigrant Employment Council and ACCES Employment.
But are we doing enough?
Ratna Omidvar, president of the Maytree Foundation, and Satish Rai, senior vice-president of TD Bank Financial Group, took reader questions in an earlier discussion. Below is a transcript of that discussion.
nhulsman - Hi, this is Noel Hulsman, our discussion with Satish Rai, chief investment officer for TD Asset Management and Ratna Omidvar, president of the Maytree foundation will begin in 10 minutes.
10:54 [Comment From Satish Rai ]
Hi Noel
10:56 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar ]
Hi All, Ratna here.
10:57 nhulsman - Ratna and Satish, thanks so much for joining us today. This is critically important topic, both socially and economically, to the future of this country. My first question concerns the idea that we have a great many skilled immigrants in Canada, whose talents are not being fully leveraged. Do we have any knowledge of how deep and wide that talent pool is? How many accountants, engineers, doctors, plumbers, electricians, etc do we have in the country not currently using their skills? Where are they? And is anyone keeping track?
11:00 [Comment From Satish Rai]
We do know that 25% of recent immigrants with a university degree employed between 1991 and 2001 had a job that required no more than a high school diploma so we know that there is a meaningful amount of under umployedment in Canada
11:01 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
The talent pool is deep and wide. More than 60% of immigrants have post-secondary education, and yet only 40% are working in their field of training. This is a real challenge, and costing Canada 3.4 and 5 billion dollars a year. Over and above, there are lost opportunities for world markets, innovation and talent.
11:02 nhulsman - How much specific information do we have on that talent pool? Is it mostly engineers, accountants, doctors? Other?
11:02 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
The federal government does keep track of intended occupations and where they intend to settle. But this does not take into account where people eventually settle and work.
11:04 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
In the regulated occupations, the highest proportion are engineers. However, this can be a bit misleading because the term is applied in different ways in different countries.
11:05 nhulsman - If it is engineers, where does the work need to begin? On the part of the professional engineer's association? On the part of employers seeking engineers? The engineering schools in Canada to provide additional training, if needed? The engineers themselves?
11:06 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
The federal government now limits the skilled worker class to 29 occupations. You can find them here: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/skilled/apply-who-instructions.asp
11:06 [Comment From JMS ]
Satish, I believe that a 2004 StatCan study puts the number of ITIs who worked a high-school level job at 58%.
11:08 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
The problem is complex, and requires all the stakeholders you mentioned to have a problem solving role. For instance, engineering schools in Canada can provide just-in-time gap filling so that immigrants don't have to repeat their education. Licensing bodies need to remove unnecessary barriers to licensure, like Canadian work experience. Engineers themselves need to prepare, pre-arrival, for employment in Canada.
11:10 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
Employers are also playing their part. For example, TransCanada hires newcomers with foreign engineering credentials as technologists, giving them a job in their field while they move through the accreditation process.
11:10 nhulsman - The issue of "unnecessary barriers" is one that is frequently mentioned. Has there been any movement here? Is there examples, whether in Europe or the U.S. where some of those barriers have been removed?
Comment From Satish Rai ]
We also experience problems within the financial sector.
11:13 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
The EU is leading the charge on this on a regional basis, because they have articulated agreements and protocols on recognition across member nations. In Canada, the federal government is developing a Foreign Qualifications Recognition Framework to encourage the provinces to create a path for newcomer licensure. But it is slow work, which may not show results immediately.
11:15 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
Most skilled immigrants will not be employed in regulated occupations. They will be in HR, communications, business development, finance, marketing... and the only thing between them and a job is a Canadian employer willing to take a risk.
11:16 [Comment From Satish Rai]
one of the barriers is that hiring managers may not understand the credentials. At TD we are piloting a project to help hiring mangers compare foreign credentials with North American
11:16 nhulsman - Satish, tell us more about that program. How does it work?
11:17 [Comment From Satish Rai]
Other barriers may include communications Skills. One area of focus for us at TD is providing language skills training for our employees
11:19 [Comment From Tanara ]
How do we support small business (SME's) in the private and nonprofit sector in doing a better job at hiring new canadians. Larger companies seem to have more structures in place that support hiring and retaining new Canadians?
11:19 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
TD is a huge champion it has more than 700 mentors in the GTA mentoring skilled immigrants. These mentors are the eyes and ears of TD on the ground, and TD has hired many of their mentees.
11:19 [Comment From Satish Rai]
We are workimg with a third party to help us provide comparisions between foreign credentials and North American. this way a hiring mangers can better compare the skills, education and background with their north American peers
11:20 nhulsman - I want to get to the SMB question, but just before we leave credentials, is that third party based in Canada? Or do you have different parties for China, India, Brazil, etc?
11:22 [Comment From Guest]
Our pilot is with a Canadian firm thta is supporting our credential verification program
11:22 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
That is a great question Tanara. Here at Maytree we are trying to answer that as well. SMEs employ 64% of private sector workers, and contribute 45% of national GDP. They are an important group to engage on this issue, and have a lot to benefit. We are doing some research on how we can help them access this talent pool better. We hope to have this research completed at the end of the year.
11:23 [Comment From Guest]
The issue is that it is not that foreign trained profession do not have the credentials rather that hiring managers do not recognize them
11:24 [Comment From Satish Rai]
the group we are parterning with is call World Education Services
11:24 [Comment From JMS ]
In addition to the Pan-Canadian Framework, the federal government has implemented an operational mechanism, the Federal Internship for Newcomers, which is a short-term, paid employment opportunity for recently arrived skilled immigrants. From its pilot-stage onward, it has received excellent feedback, and it's an example of how employers of all sizes can overcome the ITI hiring-uncertainty, as their risk is limited within to the term of the contract.
nhulsman - Ratna, if I run a SMB and want to tap into this labour pool, say I need three accountants, where do I start?
11:26 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
Here is a great and entertaining tool, for hiring managers who want to learn about inclusive hiring practices. http://www.hireimmigrants.ca/tools/4
11:27 [Comment From Tanara ]
It seems to be challenging. When smaller operations are looking for skilled labour they often have limited resources so they hire individuals with credientials they recognize, canadian experience etc.
11:28 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
There are several community agencies that can provide you with candidates for these roles. www.hireimmigrants.ca has a list of organizations in different communities that can assist you. There is also a website called skillsinternational.ca where employers can browse resumes of job-ready candidates. Careerbridge.ca helps you find interns from many fields including accounting.
11:28 [Comment From Satish Rai]
one way we hiring new immigrants is through our community out reach program We have source numerous high quality talent. We would encourage other to do so also
11:29 nhulsman - Satish: How extensive is the outreach? Do you confine it to skilled newcomers to Canada or do you also recruit abroad?
11:31 [Comment From Satish Rai]
Our inititives fully align with the community support work we do. Our hiring does tajke place within Canada. We do however have a web site that helps new immigrants before and once they have landed in Canada, through TDCanadatrust.com
11:31 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
Tanara, Government could play a role in helping address the challenges you mention. In Quebec, for example, the provincial government provides a wage subsidy to skilled immigrants in regulated and unregulated occupations, which began as a program focused on SMBs.
11:33 [Comment From JMS ]
Many agencies provide pre-screening services that help reduce the number of resumes that SMEs have to consider -- in Ottawa, we have the Ottawa Job Match Network (OJMN), which is a one-stop recruitment mechanism that draws on the resources and talent pools of several local agencies.
11:34 nhulsman - Satish, you may not be able to speak to this, but some have argued that we have a shortage of unskilled talent in Canada, and that's an issue that isn't receiving nearly as much attention. Ratna: What are you views on that?
11:34 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
Noel, while we look at challenges, it's also important to look at winning ideas. Yesterday, Canada's Top Employers of New Canadians were honoured. Their stories, creativity and innovation in finding new ways of tapping into talent should be an inspiration to all. For instance, Davis and Henderson provides a bonus to those employees who take language upgrading. Nordion Inc. provides their recruiters and hiring managers with cross-cutural training. Lots to learn from these good ideas!
11:36 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
Canada is a dynamic, knowledge-based economy. While we will always have a demand in the service industry and in other industries which need low-skilled workers, we must remember that our future economic success is closely tied to those sectors which demand a high level of human capital.
11:38 nhulsman - We're up against the clock, Ratna and Satish, if I could get closing comments from you, I would be most grateful. What is the one thing you'd like to see happen next?
11:38 [Comment From Satish Rai]
We do know that new immigrants are the life blood of our economy and possibly our futute. It is important to recoginze that it is essential for businees and Canada as a whole
11:39 [Comment From Satish Rai]
At TD we would like to see new immigrants fully employed within our economy and in particular within the financial services industry
11:42 [Comment From Ratna Omidvar]
Three final thoughts: 1) Skilled immigrants can benefit an employer's workforce and help grow their business. 2) This is not rocket science, employers can look at winning practices: www.canadastop100.com/immigrants/ 3) there is help available to them virtually and locally. Virtually, at www.hireimmigrants.ca and locally at www.alliescanada.ca
11:42 nhulsman - Satish and Ratna, thank you so much for your time and insights today. This is a a conversation that needs to continue.